Maximizing Free Rebids

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robb	Maximizing Free Rebids	Lead	[-]
Posts: 42 (02/06/03 8:44 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	Tags : None I just learned something new about free rebidding today that I had not seen covered here. I'm not sure if it is a change in Priceline behavior or something of which I just was just foolishly unaware, but I thought I'd share it anyway and see if others knew this. Here is a hypothetical city: Zone A: Has 4* Hotels Zone B: Nothing 4* or above Zone C: Nothing 4* or above Zone D: Nothing 4* or above Before today, I saw this as three free rebid zones and only three free rebidding opportunities for a 4* Zone A hotel. (A+B, A+B+C, and A+B+C+D) However, I discovered today that by creating new bids and bidding in a precise order, this can actually yield SIX free rebids. 1. Bid A 2. Bid A + B (as a free rebid) 3. Bid A + C (on a totally new bid) 4. Bid A + D (on a totally new bid) 5. Bid A + B + C (on a totally new bid) 6. Bid A + B + D (on a totally new bid) 7. Bid A + B + C + D (as a free rebid) It turns out that priceline doesn't realize that bids 2 and 3 combined exactly duplicate Bid 5, so it lets bid 5 go through. This, of course, doesn't work in reverse. If you did Bid 5 first, it would block bids 1, 2, and 3 as duplicate bids, so you have to keep starting new bids to avoid unintentionally burning opportunities at once. In cities with even more free rebidding zones, the extra bids grow dramatically. Was I the only one who didn't know this? If so, where else should I be looking for tips, as I never got this from any of the FAQ's? Thanks for the site, it has saved me tons and I always use the amazing bargains link!
Sheryl	Re: Maximizing Free Rebids	#1	[-]
Posts: 139449 (02/06/03 9:05 PM) Administrator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	This has been posted before and yes, it's valid. Our FAQs can be overwhelming to newbies. Advanced strategies like this can cause confusion, and actually backfire if not followed exactly. In fact, the whole concept of free re-bidding has caused a lot of confusion for some of our users. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ BiddingForTravel.com can only remain a free resource through the support of those who benefit from the information available. Please read my post CLICK HERE: Amazing-Bargains.com Please place your Priceline bids through this link Expedia--Check for Special Hotel Rates and Web Fares Here Orbitz - The Travel Site with the Most Web-Only Rates on the Internet! Entertainment Book - 2003 Book--$10 Off and Free Shipping--NO MINIMUM PURCHASE!
verncoles	great post!	#2	[-]
Posts: 38 (02/26/03 11:04 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	I just wanted to thank the OP for a great post. At times when reading through the boards I couldn't help but wonder: "Aren't there MORE free rebids??" I can't wait to try out this new wrinkle. I'm looking for a resort hotel in the Ka'anapali -Lahaina part of Maui(A), and there are two Maui zones with no such hotels(B) and (C). So, this is very similar to what you describe above. I'm pretty sure that, I can bid as follows (even without changing minimum hotel reqs): 1-A 2-A+B (free rebid) 3-A+C (new bid) 4-A+B+C (free rebid) I believe (not sure here) that there's a mathematical way to determine the number of extra bids. If my formula is right, then you know to keep looking if you don't come up with the right number immediately. (1) Figure out the number of free zones (3 in the OP's example; 2 in mine); (2) Figure out the "additorial" of that number, i.e., the sum of all positive integers up to and including that number. For example "3 additorial" is 3+2+1 = 6, which is exactly the number of extra bids in the OP's example, for a total of 7 including the original bid. In my case, there are 2 free zones. "2 additorial" is 2+1=3. For a total of 4 bids including with my original bid. Another wrinkle to be considered is how to combine this most efficiently with the freebids that arise from expanding the search/bid to include non-existent hotels fo a lower class. For example, in the case of my Maui search, none of the 3 zones I mentioned above has any 4* hotels other than the resort hotels I'm interested in (based on the best available information). Under my prior approach, this gave me one extra bid (I bid A, then A+B, then A+B+C, then A+B+C for resort OR 4*; then the bids were out). I think it should be possible to use this approach, combined with the OP's approach, to get at least 2 or 3 extra bids. If anyone has done the math on this, I'd love to hear it. Finally, I understand the concern about overloading newbies with advanced FAQ. Perhaps the FAQ could have a link to advanced bidding techniques so those interested (and mathematically inclined) could study for the Priceline PhD, without unduly burdening the newbies struggling to pass Priceline 101. Apologies if this suggestion has been made many times before.
puchalskir	Re: great post!	#3	[-]
Posts: 241 (02/26/03 11:19 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	I think the number of total bids is (I could be wrong): 2^(n-1) where n is the total number of zones(B,C,D,etc) where you can bid a rebid plus the original zone (A). e.g. no free re-bid 2^(1-1) = 1, A 1 free re-bids 2^(2-1) = 2, A, A&B 2 free re-bids 2^(3-1) = 4, A, A&B, A&C, A&B&C 3 free re-bids 2^(4-1) = 8, A, A&B, A&C, A&D, A&B&C, A&B&D,A&C&D, A&B&C&D. 4 free re-bids 2^(5-1) = 16.......... Rich
verncoles	free rebids-redux	#4	[-]
Posts: 38 (02/26/03 11:23 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	So, continuing the theme from my prior post, it seems that I should be able to make 8 total bids on a resort room in the Ka'anapali-Lahaina zone of Maui(A). As noted, there are two free zones (B) and (C) with no relevant hotels. Also, in all 3 zones, there appear to be NO 4* hotels that are not also resort hotels. So it seems to me that I can make 8 bids. I would be most appreciative if someone could chime in as to whether they agree or disagree. 1. A (R only) 2. A (R or 4) 3. A+B (R only) 4. A+B (R or 4) 5. A+C (R only) 6. A+C (R or 4) 7. A+B+C (R only) 8. A+B+C (R or 4) Does this make sense? If so, would bids 3,5 & 7 need to be new bids, as opposed to rebids, since the bid is in some sense more restrictive than a prior bid, even though it's broader in others? Thanks in advance for any input.
verncoles	I think you're right	#5	[-]
Posts: 38 (02/26/03 11:29 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	I think you're right! Our formulas work out the same for mine (two squared = 4, which is the same as 1+(2+1)=4 Your formula doesn't come to the same number of bids the OP had (where as mine does), but I think OP left out A+C+D. Is that right?
verncoles	more	#6	[-]
Posts: 38 (02/26/03 11:37 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	The 2^(n-1) formula also works for 5 zones so I think I'm convinced. Since I jotted them down here they are. A, AB, AC, AD, AE, ABC, ABD, ABE, ACD, ACE, ADE, ABCD, ABCE, ACDE, ABDE, ABCDE
puchalskir	Re: free rebids-redux	#7	[-]
Posts: 241 (02/26/03 12:21 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	Basically, you can look at the Resort and 4* as separate bids, so: Resort 2^(3-1)=4 4* 2^(3-1)=4 total = 8. This assumes that you are indifferent between 4*'s and resorts. Thanks for the math puzzle. It's a nice break from work. Rich
verncoles	still more	#8	[-]
Posts: 38 (02/26/03 12:42 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	"Basically, you can look at the Resort and 4* as separate bids, so: Resort 2^(3-1)=4 4* 2^(3-1)=4 total = 8. This assumes that you are indifferent between 4's and resorts." Actually, in the area I'm interested in there are no 4s other than the resorts. So I think I'm in the clear for 8 bids. Today is a rare slow day for me at work, but yes I can see how duty calls. If anyone else has a view as to whether we're right on all of this, please weight in. Thanks!
Marina	Re: still more	#9	[-]
Posts: 160 (03/31/03 8:18 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	I just tried doing this and Priceline is kicking me out for multiple bids. Did Priceline close this loophole or am I just doing it wrong?
tds1	Multiple bids	#10	[-]
Posts: 94 (04/01/03 12:30 AM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	Marina- Can you give more specific details of how you were bidding? I have not had any trouble recently... Maybe you placed an identical bid less than 3 days ago???
Marina	Re: Multiple bids	#11	[-]
Posts: 160 (04/02/03 7:19 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	I'm sorry, I don't remember exactly. I had plenty of rebids and was just trying it for a lark.
robb	The order is key	#12	[-]
Posts: 42 (04/07/03 5:06 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	You have to bid these in precisely the right order. Once you bid a combination, priceline blocks anything that matches that combination or any subcombination thereof. Therefore, once you bid A+B+C, priceline will block any bids for A+B+C, A+B, A+C, B+C, A, B, or C as duplicate rebids. But, if you make sure to bid them in the opposite order, priceline isn't smart enough to catch the duplication: A, B, C, A+B, A+C, B+C, A+B+C, in that order never triggers an exact duplication. That is probably why priceline blocked you. Write out all your possible combinations and make sure to bid ALL combinations of 2 before you ever bid any combinations of 3; ALL combinations of 3 before you ever bid a combination of 4; etc. and you should be fine.
robb	verncoles results?	#13	[-]
Posts: 42 (04/07/03 5:15 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	verncoles, I'm confused as I read your example that you say there are no 4* hotels, only resorts. If so, then priceline shouldn't allow you to bid 4. Make sure that you're not relying upon biddingfortravel's hotel lists which are by no means comprehensive. If priceline shows you a 4 option, that means there are 4* hotels in that zone and you might end up with something of lower quality than you expected (or at an overbid : ). Sometimes, if you really know a market or if your needs are flexible, that may be an acceptable risk, but a future reader might get confused.
Sheryl	Resort/4*	#14	[-]
Posts: 139449 (04/07/03 5:37 PM) Administrator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	*Quote:* I'm confused as I read your example that you say there are no 4* hotels, only resorts. If so, then priceline shouldn't allow you to bid 4...If priceline shows you a 4 option, that means there are 4* hotels in that zone Wherever Priceline displays Resort, they always display 4, even when there are no 4 non-Resorts. While some zones do have both Resorts and 4* non-Resorts, many of the Resort zones do not have 4* non-Resorts, so in those cases, we use 4* as a bona fide free re-bid. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ BiddingForTravel.com can only remain a free resource through the support of those who benefit from the information available. Please read my post CLICK HERE: Amazing-Bargains.com Please place your Priceline bids through this link Expedia--Check for Special Hotel Rates and Web Fares Here Orbitz - The Travel Site with the Most Web-Only Rates on the Internet! Entertainment Book - 2003 Book--$10 Off and Free Shipping--NO MINIMUM PURCHASE!
Marina	Re: Resort/4*	#15	[-]
Posts: 160 (04/08/03 12:36 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	Thank you Robb. I'll try your way next time I bid.
Piedro Seven	Re: Maximizing Free Rebids	#16	[-]
Posts: 65 (04/18/03 2:35 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	I am having trouble understanding when you should place a new bid versus adding an area which you know will not have a hotel rating as high as you want and make a free rebid. For example, let's say you want a 4Hotel in Area a of City x. The city is divided into four areas and areas b,c and d do not have a 4 hotel. You make an initial bid and it is rejected. You add area b (a free rebid), rebid and it is rejected. Now, can you delete area b and replace it with area c and rebid again? Then can you do the same and delete area c and add area d and rebid again? Then can do the same and delete area d and add areas b and c and rebid again and so on? Or at some point do you walk away and create an entirely new bid ( a pain because you have to rereveal credit card info, address info etc. Also what about free rebidding in reverse: (The area you want has a 2.5* hotel you want and other areas only have 3* or higher hotels.) Please respond asap and I apologize for asking what others might consider to be a dumb question. Piedro Seven
Piedro Seven	Re: Maximizing Free Rebids	#17	[-]
Posts: 65 (04/18/03 9:25 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	Robb: Help me with this particular bidding: I want a 3 star hotel in Area A. There are two other zones that have no hotels of 3* or higher. How should I bid these so I don't get blocked out by priceline? Is this way correct: 1) Bid Area A and if it gets rejected add Area B. (which has no three star hotel or higher in it) 2) If both parts of number 1 get rejected, i.e. Area A and Area A with Area B added, stop bidding and create a new bid with Areas A and C (which has no 3* hotels or higher in it) and if this bid gets rejected add area B as a free rebid. What do you think about this strategy? Piedro Seven Does this sound right?
ottie1	Re: Maximizing Free Rebids	#18	[-]
Posts: 14 (05/13/03 7:01 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	Hi: Thank you so much for this thread. I just tried it over 2 days for NYC ANY ZONE 4* (and probably about 30 bids) and was never booted out though I did get messages telling me that I was duplicating a previous bid. As it turns out I didn't get the hotel for the original dates (I only got it after changing dates upon realizing I was involving memorial day). Anyway, I have a few questions. First, here are the particulars: (A)MTE 5* (B)MTW 4* (C)LM 4* (D)MTS 4* (E)UM 4* (F)UES 4* (G)UWS 2.5* 1. Since the 2nd thru 6th zone all have 4* hotels are there going to be wasted bids by going thru all the tiers? In other words, I tried to follow as best as possible the formula though I did skip around a little (these were all new bids; I understand now I could've saved a little time by making the shift to the next higher "zone tier" a re-bid): A $70 A+B $75 A+C $75 A+D $75 A+E $75 A+F $75 A+G $75 A+B+C $80 (I switched to 80 here b/c I had bid 75 on every zone for 4* hotel even though of course G has no 4) A+B+D $80 A+B+E $80 A+B+F $80 A+B+G $80 A+C+D $85 (Again, I switched here b/c in effect at this point I had now bid 80 on every zone for 4 hotel again even though of course G has no 4) A+C+E $85 A+C+F $85 A+C+G $85 A+D+E $86 A+D+F $86 A+D+G $86 I gave up after bidding A+B+C+D 4 $88 and being rejected b/c I realized E & F were much higher priced zones (finally having found Sheryl's sound advice about carefully planning the order of what Zones A,B,C, etc. are going to be and after while I started to wonder whether throwing G in a re-bid after having already bid all other 4* zones was doing any good. 2. I wasn't really sure when to up the $ and by how much. In other words, as hopefully my illustration above shows, I only upped my bid $ once I involved one more "zone tier" in the bidding sequence (i.e. going from bidding A to A+B and then going from bidding A+x to A+x+y (never thought being cheap was going to involve algebra but hey I've saved so much money b/c of you guys--thank you very much!)) or once I realized that thru the various combinations I had bid $X in every zone on 4* hotels. I'm assuming PriceLine's logic is not going to deny me $85 on 4* in Zone C when I bid it in one combination and then turn around and give me a 4* hotel in that Zone at $85. I had fun doing it but I'd sure like to streamline it a bit! I hope this is clear--if not just follow-up the thread and I'll get back. Thanks again, Ottie
peg2003	Re: Maximizing Free Rebids	#19	[-]
Posts: 12 (05/14/03 12:17 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	Ottie, You are confusing "free rebids" with a willingness to change zones. If you want a 4* in any of your zones, then it would make the most sense to bid one zone at a time (A, then B, then C, etc) These aren't free rebids because you are changing one of your parameters because you are willing to get a hotel in the other zones. Your bid amounts for this first round may be the same, or you may vary your bid depending on the regular hotel rates for those zones. Once you've exhausted these opportunities, you can look at free rebids by upping your bid amount and working your way back through all the 4* zones and adding zone G to each: A+G, then B+G, then C+G, etc. Once these are exhausted, you would need to up your bids again and starting adding zone combinations: A+B, A+C. . . If you are really willing to stay in any of these zones, you have a VERY high number of bidding opportunities. Does this help or is it more confusing than ever? Peggy
heynoah	Maximizing Free Rebids	#20	[-]
Posts: 36 (05/28/03 7:31 PM) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite	See if this makes sense. Since I am looking for a 5 star hotel and London has 10 zones but only 2 of the zones have 5 star ratings, would this work? Zone A and B have 5 star hotels Zones C through J only have 4 star rating Bidding as follows... A, AC, AD, AE, AF, AG, AH, AI, AJ B, BC, BD, BE, BF, BG, BH, BI, BJ AB, ABC, ABD, ABE, ABF, ABG, ABH, ABI, ABJ Would this include bids such as ABCD, ABCE, ABCF ect..? Edited by: heynoah at: 5/28/03 1:05:41 pm

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